They hold an ideology which is sick to any sane person. We must not make the mistakes of the KPD (Communist Party of Germany) and SPD (Social Democratic Party of Germany) during 1920s Germany. It was the failure of these groups to unite in an anti-Nazi front which allowed Hitler's SA thugs to control the streets. The KPD received orders from Stalin in Moscow ‘no alliance with reactionaries of the SPD’ (Social Democrats). Such orders were music to Hitler's ears because they divided the left-wing opposition which he would, on coming to power, eradicate one by one starting with the communists. Such divisions within the anti-fascists must not be allowed to happen again, learn the lessons of the past, or suffer the same fate! The fates of the KPD and SPD were final and fatal resulting in many of these groups being gassed in the murder chambers of Auschwitz, Treblinka, Sobibor or any other of the Nazi death camps. Alternatively the former political activists of the left could be worked to death on one of Nazi Germany’s bizarre projects. Either way the end was not pleasant. Across Europe such groups masquerading as political parties are on the march again, not as large as the 1930s yet but nevertheless present. In Ireland we have our share of embryonic fascist groups in the ascendancy.
As with their predecessors these groups are praying on the political ignorance and fears of local people who feel under threat from ‘asylum seekers’ and ‘refugees’ most of whom are ‘International Protection Applicants’ and have a legal right to seek protection from persecution and even death in their native countries. It is true the situation has been handled so badly by the government, I often wonder to create a backlash situation if not on purpose. Very little or no consultation has been afforded local people in the areas where these ‘refugees’ are to be accommodated which was wrong and an insult to local people. That said the groups who have latched on to these protests by local people are no more interested in these people’s concerns than I have of becoming the next Pope. People like Malachy Steenson, once in the opposite political camp in the Workers Party who espoused the absolute opposite of what he spouts now, are opportunists. Unable to be accepted in Sinn Fein/Workers Party – later just the Workers Party – or any other groups on the republican left-wing Steenson has found a home with the politics of the far-right. The politics of the groups he was formerly associated with and those he preaches now are poles apart. Why the shift, Malachy? Steenson is not alone, merely perhaps the highest profile.
Other more dangerous groups are present in Ireland and are openly Nazi such as Justin Barret and his
Clann Éireann movement. In 2024 Barrett hailed Hitler as “the greatest leader of all time” and has publicly quoted ‘Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf, performed Nazi salutes, and engaged in Holocaust denial.’ At the 102nd anniversary of the assassination of Michael Collins at Beal na Blath Barrett announced his Sciath Naisuinta organisation, the paramilitary Nazi wing of his Clann Éireann movement, so the Nazis are now reportedly armed it appears. He has also reportedly said ‘he would strip the Irish citizenship rights of local government politician Hazel Chu’. This is in spite of the fact that Hazel was born in Ireland and spent her entire life here. Hazel also served as Lord Mayor of Dublin and is well respected. It would be fair to say Barrett is a very dangerous man complemented, either directly or indirectly, accidently or otherwise, by the policies advocated by the likes of Malachy Steenson and his cohorts. These people prey on the fears of locals, many of these fears being justified, though unfounded, and exploit these fears for their own political ends. Right-wing populism espoused by former left-wing advocates is uncommon but not unknown. Oswald Moseley crossed the floor from the Labour Party to the Conservatives and kept walking in this right-wing direction, forming the British Union of Fascists (BUF) in 1932 ending up interned during the Second World War as he was deemed a supporter of the Nazis. I would suggest these people many who hitherto have not being involved in politics who are following these far-right groups think very hard. Many of these Irish groups have contacts with British far-right and fascist organisations who, it should be remembered, are linked to loyalists in the north so when they are preaching their shite, remember this. Also, I would suggest, that reactionary people like Malachy Steenson, who I do not believe is yet a fascist, read about the Night of the Long Knives which took place in Nazi Germany between 30th June and 2nd July 1934. Here people like Steenson, having been used, were murdered by the SS on the orders of Adolf Hitler, the man who Barret claims is “the greatest leader of all time”. If these people, using the fears of the good people of East Wall in Dublin for example, ever achieve their aims on the backs of people’s ignorance imagine what may well happen. Stop these gangs and stop them now
How do we deal with this fascist threat? History teaches us they must be stopped in the early days. Failure to do this could result in Ireland becoming a fascist 26-County state, or even a 32-County state bearing two flags! Back in the eighties groups like Anti-Fascist Action (AFA) confronted the fascists off the streets of London, Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow. This approach of meeting violence with street resistance worked but, supported by ideological polemics, worked all the better. Supporting the street resistance, ideological debates and polemics must take place because beating the far-right ideologically is as important, if not more so in many respects, as is the confrontations on the streets. AFA is active in Ireland, and all groups, I would suggest, should join or affiliate to this broad-church anti-fascist group. Back in the 1930s republicans openly engaged and fought the fascist Blue Shirts in Ireland so we do have a tradition of anti-fascism.
The Israeli historian of the Holocaust, Yehuda Bauer, a strong supporter of the Palestinian cause and a two-state solution with a Palestinian nation state alongside Israel, had, regarding the Holocaust, three commandments:
1) “There should be no victims”.
2) “There should be no perpetrators”
3) “There should be no bystanders”
Put bluntly such horrors as the Holocaust should not happen ever again yet we see groups, such as those led by the likes of Justin Barrett, openly advocating the policies of the Nazi Third Reich for Ireland! The Nazi Holocaust was a huge iceberg which the far-right across Ireland and the rest of Europe represent only the tip of. Do the people, initially under genuine concerns over lack of consultation regarding International Protection Seekers, who are following these groups realise what they really stand for? Do they realise if such ideologies ever come to fruition in Ireland or anywhere else in the world that today’s followers could well be tomorrow’s victims? Today in Ireland we have many non-fascists, that is those who would not support fascism but neither would they fight it either on the streets or ideologically. These would loosely be classed in today’s world as Bauers “bystanders”. Some see anti-fascists as being too communist led and, not understanding communism apart from what they read in the media, want nothing to do with anti-fascist groups. It is true groups such as AFA do contain Socialists, Communists, and Anarchists but they also have within their ranks many non-communists, even liberals, who are equally anti-fascist. This is a single-issue task and all other ideologies, apart from combatting fascism, goes out of the window otherwise we will lose the fight. Learn the lessons of history: the failure of the KPD and SPD in Germany to unite allowed Hitler's Nazis to control the streets. A similar situation arose during the Spanish Civil War near Barcelona when the Stalinists and the Syndicalists opened fire on each other. This incident which turned into a battle between the two ideological opponents was music to Franco and the fascists ears.
In the 26-Counties members of Sinn Fein, Labour, People Before Profit/Solidarity, and the Social Democrats hold anti-fascist views along with organisations outside Dail Eireann such as the IRSP. Any anti-fascist movement will be broad churched and, for example, younger members of street fighting age from Sinn Fein, may be standing alongside rival republican organisations like the IRSP. Any ideological infighting should be parked for the purposes of fighting fascism. This does not mean any political party’s ideology should be forgotten, merely parked up for ad hoc anti-fascist reasons. The time for action against the far-right is now, not when they have half the Dail filled with TDs and local authorities are bursting at the seams with them. Do not allow what happened in Germany during the late 1920s and early 1930s to happen here. At the moment the fascists control the streets. This must stop. Only on these streets can younger able bodied anti-fascists stop them. In the debating chambers is where the political-ideological debates and even polemics begin and are won! AFA appear to be the major anti-fascist organisation in Ireland. and the larger and more influential they become the better, at least in theory, but beware of infiltration something which is always a problem. Remember these far-right groups do not have the long-term interests of those who naively follow them now at heart. Those who are encouraged to burn refugees out of their temporary accommodation are being used by a faceless leadership who are often under the control of fascist and right-wing groups in Britain.
The recent electoral success in England of the Reform UK Party, led by Nigel Farage, is concerning. Reform UK do not tell us their long-term plans regarding the Six-Counties and the Good Friday Agreement. They wish to renegotiate the GFA along unionist lines even more so than the present unionist weighted version. Longer-term, they allegedly have ideas to reunite Ireland under the union flag with the British Monarch as head of state. The far-right in Ireland are merely tools in a far bigger toolbox so, to those who follow these, in many cases, pawns to the British far-right, think again. To those good folk on Dublin’s East Wall, who claim the tradition of James Connolly and the Irish Citizen Army, remember this; it was Connolly who welcomed Jewish people into Ireland, even having his 1903 Wood Quay election manifesto translated and written in Hebrew so that the Jewish population could understand. It was James Connolly who while in the USA argued vehemently with Irish American workers against racism and their harassment of Italian, Chinese, and Polish workers. It was the same James Connolly who remonstrated with the descendants of George Washington over their treatment of black people. This is the tradition you belong to, not this neo-Nazi front you have been led down the garden path with.
Stop The Fascists And Stop Them Now!
As with their predecessors these groups are praying on the political ignorance and fears of local people who feel under threat from ‘asylum seekers’ and ‘refugees’ most of whom are ‘International Protection Applicants’ and have a legal right to seek protection from persecution and even death in their native countries. It is true the situation has been handled so badly by the government, I often wonder to create a backlash situation if not on purpose. Very little or no consultation has been afforded local people in the areas where these ‘refugees’ are to be accommodated which was wrong and an insult to local people. That said the groups who have latched on to these protests by local people are no more interested in these people’s concerns than I have of becoming the next Pope. People like Malachy Steenson, once in the opposite political camp in the Workers Party who espoused the absolute opposite of what he spouts now, are opportunists. Unable to be accepted in Sinn Fein/Workers Party – later just the Workers Party – or any other groups on the republican left-wing Steenson has found a home with the politics of the far-right. The politics of the groups he was formerly associated with and those he preaches now are poles apart. Why the shift, Malachy? Steenson is not alone, merely perhaps the highest profile.
Other more dangerous groups are present in Ireland and are openly Nazi such as Justin Barret and his
Clann Éireann movement. In 2024 Barrett hailed Hitler as “the greatest leader of all time” and has publicly quoted ‘Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf, performed Nazi salutes, and engaged in Holocaust denial.’ At the 102nd anniversary of the assassination of Michael Collins at Beal na Blath Barrett announced his Sciath Naisuinta organisation, the paramilitary Nazi wing of his Clann Éireann movement, so the Nazis are now reportedly armed it appears. He has also reportedly said ‘he would strip the Irish citizenship rights of local government politician Hazel Chu’. This is in spite of the fact that Hazel was born in Ireland and spent her entire life here. Hazel also served as Lord Mayor of Dublin and is well respected. It would be fair to say Barrett is a very dangerous man complemented, either directly or indirectly, accidently or otherwise, by the policies advocated by the likes of Malachy Steenson and his cohorts. These people prey on the fears of locals, many of these fears being justified, though unfounded, and exploit these fears for their own political ends. Right-wing populism espoused by former left-wing advocates is uncommon but not unknown. Oswald Moseley crossed the floor from the Labour Party to the Conservatives and kept walking in this right-wing direction, forming the British Union of Fascists (BUF) in 1932 ending up interned during the Second World War as he was deemed a supporter of the Nazis. I would suggest these people many who hitherto have not being involved in politics who are following these far-right groups think very hard. Many of these Irish groups have contacts with British far-right and fascist organisations who, it should be remembered, are linked to loyalists in the north so when they are preaching their shite, remember this. Also, I would suggest, that reactionary people like Malachy Steenson, who I do not believe is yet a fascist, read about the Night of the Long Knives which took place in Nazi Germany between 30th June and 2nd July 1934. Here people like Steenson, having been used, were murdered by the SS on the orders of Adolf Hitler, the man who Barret claims is “the greatest leader of all time”. If these people, using the fears of the good people of East Wall in Dublin for example, ever achieve their aims on the backs of people’s ignorance imagine what may well happen. Stop these gangs and stop them now
How do we deal with this fascist threat? History teaches us they must be stopped in the early days. Failure to do this could result in Ireland becoming a fascist 26-County state, or even a 32-County state bearing two flags! Back in the eighties groups like Anti-Fascist Action (AFA) confronted the fascists off the streets of London, Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow. This approach of meeting violence with street resistance worked but, supported by ideological polemics, worked all the better. Supporting the street resistance, ideological debates and polemics must take place because beating the far-right ideologically is as important, if not more so in many respects, as is the confrontations on the streets. AFA is active in Ireland, and all groups, I would suggest, should join or affiliate to this broad-church anti-fascist group. Back in the 1930s republicans openly engaged and fought the fascist Blue Shirts in Ireland so we do have a tradition of anti-fascism.
The Israeli historian of the Holocaust, Yehuda Bauer, a strong supporter of the Palestinian cause and a two-state solution with a Palestinian nation state alongside Israel, had, regarding the Holocaust, three commandments:
1) “There should be no victims”.
2) “There should be no perpetrators”
3) “There should be no bystanders”
Put bluntly such horrors as the Holocaust should not happen ever again yet we see groups, such as those led by the likes of Justin Barrett, openly advocating the policies of the Nazi Third Reich for Ireland! The Nazi Holocaust was a huge iceberg which the far-right across Ireland and the rest of Europe represent only the tip of. Do the people, initially under genuine concerns over lack of consultation regarding International Protection Seekers, who are following these groups realise what they really stand for? Do they realise if such ideologies ever come to fruition in Ireland or anywhere else in the world that today’s followers could well be tomorrow’s victims? Today in Ireland we have many non-fascists, that is those who would not support fascism but neither would they fight it either on the streets or ideologically. These would loosely be classed in today’s world as Bauers “bystanders”. Some see anti-fascists as being too communist led and, not understanding communism apart from what they read in the media, want nothing to do with anti-fascist groups. It is true groups such as AFA do contain Socialists, Communists, and Anarchists but they also have within their ranks many non-communists, even liberals, who are equally anti-fascist. This is a single-issue task and all other ideologies, apart from combatting fascism, goes out of the window otherwise we will lose the fight. Learn the lessons of history: the failure of the KPD and SPD in Germany to unite allowed Hitler's Nazis to control the streets. A similar situation arose during the Spanish Civil War near Barcelona when the Stalinists and the Syndicalists opened fire on each other. This incident which turned into a battle between the two ideological opponents was music to Franco and the fascists ears.
In the 26-Counties members of Sinn Fein, Labour, People Before Profit/Solidarity, and the Social Democrats hold anti-fascist views along with organisations outside Dail Eireann such as the IRSP. Any anti-fascist movement will be broad churched and, for example, younger members of street fighting age from Sinn Fein, may be standing alongside rival republican organisations like the IRSP. Any ideological infighting should be parked for the purposes of fighting fascism. This does not mean any political party’s ideology should be forgotten, merely parked up for ad hoc anti-fascist reasons. The time for action against the far-right is now, not when they have half the Dail filled with TDs and local authorities are bursting at the seams with them. Do not allow what happened in Germany during the late 1920s and early 1930s to happen here. At the moment the fascists control the streets. This must stop. Only on these streets can younger able bodied anti-fascists stop them. In the debating chambers is where the political-ideological debates and even polemics begin and are won! AFA appear to be the major anti-fascist organisation in Ireland. and the larger and more influential they become the better, at least in theory, but beware of infiltration something which is always a problem. Remember these far-right groups do not have the long-term interests of those who naively follow them now at heart. Those who are encouraged to burn refugees out of their temporary accommodation are being used by a faceless leadership who are often under the control of fascist and right-wing groups in Britain.
The recent electoral success in England of the Reform UK Party, led by Nigel Farage, is concerning. Reform UK do not tell us their long-term plans regarding the Six-Counties and the Good Friday Agreement. They wish to renegotiate the GFA along unionist lines even more so than the present unionist weighted version. Longer-term, they allegedly have ideas to reunite Ireland under the union flag with the British Monarch as head of state. The far-right in Ireland are merely tools in a far bigger toolbox so, to those who follow these, in many cases, pawns to the British far-right, think again. To those good folk on Dublin’s East Wall, who claim the tradition of James Connolly and the Irish Citizen Army, remember this; it was Connolly who welcomed Jewish people into Ireland, even having his 1903 Wood Quay election manifesto translated and written in Hebrew so that the Jewish population could understand. It was James Connolly who while in the USA argued vehemently with Irish American workers against racism and their harassment of Italian, Chinese, and Polish workers. It was the same James Connolly who remonstrated with the descendants of George Washington over their treatment of black people. This is the tradition you belong to, not this neo-Nazi front you have been led down the garden path with.
Stop The Fascists And Stop Them Now!
 |
| Caoimhin O’Muraile is Independent Socialist Republican and Marxist. |
Well I'm a lefty Loyalist so "remember that". Stop using broad strokes in castigation of your perceived enemy Caomihin, we have far more in common than divides us.
ReplyDeleteI don't believe we are of very different points of view on this. All people should be treated with compassion, but when exactly did the South or the UK agree to the unfettered migration of unchecked migrants? Neither State is set up to accommodate this. I cannot be the only person who has a tale to tell regards family not being able to get a Doctors appointment due to an overstretched Health Service? People who I grew up with not able to get homes in the areas they grew up in but yet people from "El Salvador, Romania and Albania" have been allocated housing there?
There is an issue to be addressed and slinging the "-ist" shite isn't a part of the solution. Regards to Islam I defer to a far greater intellect than I.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0EYg8Tgrh0o
Steve - I think Caoimhin avoids reducing it to fascism. In fact he avoids calling Malachy Steenson a fascist and is attuned to the concerns of communities which he does not label racist. At the same time we should be under no illusion about the fascist element at play. I know he is a figure of fun that even some on the far right ridicule but there seems little wrong in characterising Justin Barrett as a fascist.
DeleteThis unfettered migration of unchecked immigrants seems to be be groundless. Ireland does not have an open borders policy.
Is immigration a problem? Of course it is. Anything that puts strain on a societal infrastructure has to be considered a problem. If a table isn't big enough to seat everyone it is counterintuitive to call for more people. But we can either blame the people seeking food or build a bigger table if the resources are there to do it.
While we have nation states where the task of national governments is to build infrastructure fit for purpose there will always be a built-in tension between that infrastructure and immigration. Pretending otherwise is as useful as praying.
One challenge to the left is is that it has a strategy for immigration but no strategy other than waffle and sloganising for the consequence of immigration which is immigration is an organising principle for the far right. Screaming fascist at everybody who has concerns will most likely see those labelled migrate towards the fascist camp. I have heard people labelled fascist because they do not agree with abortion. That is a Catholic perspective not a fascist one.
On Islam - Hitchens was right about how Islamophobia was going to become a weapon to muzzle dissent. I don't want to see religious interference of any hue in the sphere of public policy. If a person is oppose to abortion or same sex marriage they should never be forced into them. At the same time they should not have the ability to coerce those who want same sex marriage or abortion out of availing of them. It is the coercive element that adds the fascistic colouring.
AM, you refer to strain on infrastructure and such like.
DeleteWhat about the transformative impact of migration on culture and politics? The last mass inward demographic movement of people resulted in hundreds of years of conflict - the legacy of which we live with to the present. This is not simply a question of resources but by sheer weight of numbers a question as to whether the Irish will survive beyond this century. It might even cost us a 'yes' result in a border poll before then.
Given current demographic trends, the Irish may become a minority in their homeland within a few decades. Is this what Kevin and the left support? Because that's what's going to happen.
ReplyDeleteThat is nonsense, the same arguments the fascist groups, BNP, NF, BM and other Hitlerite groups in Britain advocate. The claim, as do you regards the Irish in Ireland, that British people will become a "minority" in their "own country". Every year thousands of Irish emmigrate perhaps you should stop people leaving Ireland as well as preventing folk coming in? These arguments about "becoming a minority" in their own country is as old as the hills and twice as boring.
ReplyDeleteCaoimhin O'Muraile
It has echoes of the Great Replacement Theory. I think a more realistic argument is that immigration leads to multiculturalism which leads to the question of whether multiculturalism is a good thing. It certainly produces strains and can lead to cultural relativism.
DeleteI think every society if it is to be centrally governed has to have core precepts in place that apply to everybody. This is why Maryam Namazie who often features on this blog is so emphatic about One Law For All.
A society that makes reporting of child sex abuse can't make exceptions for clergy. I think circumcision should also be banned unless carried out for medical reasons. A society can still be inclusive without giving into strange religious rituals.
Kevin, the Irish are already a minority in Dublin North Central. According to the 2022 census data they were on the edge of becoming a minority in Galway and Cork. In new developments in west Dublin, the Irish are as little as 10 percent of the population in some areas. They are a minority in several towns in Leitrim, Mayo and Roscommon. They are 50% of the population of Clones. This is all official data.
DeleteIs this what you support? Why can't you give a direct answer rather than insist that it isn't happening? Why have the ruling classes opened the floodgates, what the Financial Times terms "human quantitive easing". Why has the left not offered any serious analysis on the economics of immigration beyond liberal platitudes?
Btw, we know each other personally. I've nothing to do with Barrett and whoever else. It's a ssilly argument designed to brow beat people. Sooner or later it'll stop working.
I learnt many, many years ago to treat official figures with a pinch of salt. They are often sanitised figures. I remember years ago a National Front leaflet complaining of "four million" Irish landing on British shores, "wjy don't they fuck off back to their own impoverished country". It went on; "we should stand with our loyal friends in Ulster" and, words to the effect of, get rid of these Irish scroungers. The leaflet was sickening and was the subje t of many 'confrontations' with the fascists.
ReplyDeleteNow many intended victims of that NF leaflet are saying the same about migrants coming to Ireland, or something similar.
I think aspects of cultural intergration are good. Obviously and equally other aspects, as Anthony pointed out, are not welcome and must be stamped out. Oh, I live in north inner city Dublin and where I live is overwhelmingly Irish. The same goes for surrounding areas.
Caoimhin O'Muraile
We can't dismiss official figures out of hand otherwise we end up sounding like the far right ranting against science and expertise. It is how the figures are presented by others outside of their context that can often cause the problem.
DeleteI am in Dublin regularly enough and the only place I see a lot of people from other countries is in the city centre. I also see them staffing the hospitals.
There was another statistic in the paper today. The Free State will spent 1.6 billion on IPAS centres this year. There is a massive wealth transfer to gombeens going on - the left and republicans have nothing to say about it. Give it a few years and they'll be scratching their heads as to how the far right gained so much ground.
DeleteThere are many foreigners in the health service. I was looked after by a Filipino
nurse recently and was very pleased with the level of care. But the facts are out there. The HSE announced a ban on Irish recruitment while launching recruitment drives abroad. Why?
Secondly, the Leinster House crowd have officially announced that they wish to increase the population of the Free State to seven million. The birthrate for Irish women is below replacement level - around 0.5 if I'm not mistaken. Where is this population growth going to come from? Give that birth rates are decreasing - why is demand for housing increasing? Kicking the can down the road will only succeed for so long.
Dublin housing costs ( rent & purchase have trebled since 2013 ) . 160 K immigrants arrive each year , just 30 K homes are built . What happens when Eireann soon receives many of the 1 million + annual UK inflow ? Irish adults are already top of the Euro carts for adults stuck living with parents . Jesus was a Paddy - 33 ( single ) lived with the ma & da ! An old Dublin gag .
ReplyDeleteIt appears to me, Chungus, you are just ante-foreigner you do not want anybody who is not Irish here. Firstly, the Irish are not a pure breed, nobody on earth is, and as a Dublin man you might find your own family tree has immigrants, including those who invaded and conquered by brutal force and rape may number among your descendants, particularly the 'Men of Bristol'. Secondly, many of those seeking 'international protection' have every intention of returning home once it is safe to do so. They will not hang around, quite obviously bothering you, any longer than they have to. Others may stay and these are welcome as they, like all others friend and foe of the past, will become Irish. Multi-culture is a good thing as Irish culture itself derives much from the 'foreigner'. For example French has injected much into Irish culture and names. The name 'Sean' derives from French for John which is Jean and we get Sean from the 12th century onwards. If Irish women no longer wish to have a dozen children because the Catholic Church tells them they have to and if the government want 'seven million' to populate the 26 Counties they may come from elsewhere. Is there room for 'seven million' Irish or otherwise in the 26 Counties?
ReplyDeleteCaoimhin O'Muraile
Caoimhin O'Muraile
Kevin, I notice since the beginning of this debate you've done nothing but to resort to personal insults and jibes. First you tried to link me with Barrett and his lot. Now you accuse me of xenophobia. I am too long in the tooth to be fazed by brow-beating. I have replied with statistics. You decided you don't like statistics. I don't know where the Catholic Church jibe came from - the Irish were having children up until very recently. It has nothing to do with the church. The statistics are out there. Maybe you don't like those statistics either. This is the general approach to the left to serious questions such as immigration. Sooner or later the left's brow-beating will stop working. Then what? Twenty years of analysis on 'where the left went wrong' like we got after the collapse of the republican project?
DeleteIt's time to get real.
Caoimhin - I think the far right a while back were calling for women to have more babies. It is certainly part of a wider far right initiative to limit women's reproductive rights. Much like seeking to deny abortion. If the government planners estimate that the society needs X amount of people by say 2040 to sustain itself then it seems the most preferable and humane course to follow is to bring in people from elsewhere on a voluntary basis rather than coerce women into having children. I'm not sure how else it can be done if women continue to make the choices they do regarding having children.
DeleteIn respect of another issue you have been mulling over, I notice also that the religious racist right in America are making the argument that whites are now a minority in the States: the most marginalized people in America . . . We are the new minority ... If you're a white man, you get no rights, no privileges, no consideration in this nation any more.
It seems to be a consistent theme of far right discourse, an echo of the Great Replacement Theory.
Although it is easy to ridicule the Great Replacement Theory, it also helps to understand the reasoning behind such fears.
ReplyDeleteIreland has been going through seismic changes for nearly 40 years: coming out of Church/State led repression to be a more secular society that has embraced the best and worst excesses of capitalism through the Celtic Tiger, EU meddling and mass immigration (particularly in the last five years). Usually, such changes happen over a longer period of time but all of these have been within people's lifetimes.
As a result, a lot of existentialist questions have been asked: what does it mean to be Irish? What was the point of fighting for independence if we've willingly given it away to Brussels? Have we become estranged from our neighbours and communities? If white couples are having less children does that mean that Ireland will be the new Easter Island unless bulked up by mass immigration?
These are big questions to ponder and they do lead to a genuine sense among some that a way of life is dying off. Such thoughts can lead to feelings of hopelessness and anger. Unfortunately, proceedings aren't helped by successive governments insisting there is no problem while bussing migrants under cloak of night to various towns (an insult to those migrants as they're treated as property to be hidden away) and commentators insisting that such discussions are inherently racist and problematic then later admitting that, even if the government are bulking up on immigration, what's the problem as multiculturalism is wonderful.
As we all know, multiculturalism as a natural entity (one that develops over time as people live side by side) is a wonderful thing. As a political entity, it creates division by institutionalising racial thinking and downplays destructive behaviour in the name of tolerance. Thankfully, most recent arrivals to Ireland have happily integrated and participate in everyday life without issue.
However, the inability and unwillingness of the state and liberal commentators to understand why people might be concerned that around 20 per cent of Ireland’s current population were born outside of Ireland. Beside the Plantation of Ulster that is unprecedented in Irish history and yet the commentariat repeatedly dismiss concerns.
Like the Rushdie Affair, liberals have created their own monsters.
Christopher - that has the bones for a great stand alone piece.
DeleteI don't see how the ease with which the Great Replacement Theory can be mocked helps explain why people have fears. There is a great replacement theory and there are fears but the relationship between the two is not best explained by the ease with which GRT can be mocked. It is easily mocked because it is so false - a right wing conspiracy theory that has long been used by racists and fascists - dating back to at least the 1800s although it has become commonplace to assign its provenance to a French writer Renaud Camus, a more recent right wing contributor.
At every juncture in the evolution of Irish society fears have both emerged and been stoked in response to change. There has long been a fascist strand opposing change going right back a century. There were fears about emigration and now fears about immigration. Yet societal evolution is not possible without change.
Has sovereignty been given to Brussels or has it been pooled in an increasingly interdependent world? European institutions are an outgrowth of nations in much the same way as nations are an outgrowth of smaller entities although foundational myths work hard to make us think otherwise. A neoliberal Europe is not the Europe I prefer but it seems better than a neoliberal Ireland. Even in a socialist EU there would still be a pooling of sovereignty. The big question is of course remains what it has been since the formation of the EU and Johan Galtung's criticism of it - is pooling genuine interdependence or simply domination and dependence? I, as you know, prefer the world to be organised globally not nationally or regionally. As Pepe Mujica argued we should think as a species and not as a nation. (Gonna review a book on him this evening as he died Tuesday),
I think most of us are multicultural in the lived world in that we sample as many cultures, foods, music, sport and territories as we can. I think the problem with multiculturalism as political policy is that it can create billiard balls rather than webs. They tend to bounce off each other rather than mesh. As much as I disagree with Douglas Murray I still think he is right about the need for a number of core values in a society that all are bound by, a sort of social cement that allows national society to function rather than be pulled every which way by separate societies within a nation state. Your Rushdie observation is probably embedded in this. In that sense multiculturalism can be a regress back to the time of Kingdoms, fiefdoms, duchies, principalities - whatever. While you are right about the benefits of people living side by side, it seems the state will always have to involve itself in the management of populations. The interventionist state rather than the Laissez-faire one is the one best suited to dealing in a more benevolent manner with the difficulties posed by modern society.
The Chinese do not speak of the challenges of life in a time of change for no good reason.
If the Irish population is predicted to fall below what it requires the obvious question is how do we prevent that? Coercing women into childbirth is the favoured solution of the right; immigration the preference of the Left. I will never be in favour of enslaving women. Something of the Handmaid's Tale to that.
Immigration is not just the preference of the progressive left. It is also the preference of the capitalist class - a "paradox" the left conveniently ignores. Current immigration trends are encouraged and facilitated by governments and their affiliated NGOs. Consider the millions given in funding to projects in Tyrone, the benefactors of which include 'iconic socialist republicans,' to facilitate cheap labour for the meat-packing industry. I am at a loss as to why the left avoids discussing these questions. The nature of capitalism has changed drastically.
DeleteWe do not need to live our lives bound to a quest for eternal economic growth, particularly if it means the rapid and irreversible demographic change of our country. From demographic change will emerge cultural and political change beyond nice foods and quaint foreigners. Republicans complained for years about the post-GFA settlement in the north. This is the future that awaits the rest of the Irish people. The clientelist distribution of resources along sectarian and ethnic lines has also started in England. Is this really the society that we want?
AM,
DeleteI wasn’t making such a claim, what I was saying is that it’s important to understand why such a theory has found fertile soil before we mock it. Being able to counter such fictions work better when we understand the mindset of those who have embraced them.
People were right to be fearful of emigration as it was a brain drain on Ireland as a whole, although a bonus for the rest of the world. Unfiltered immigration offers new fears, ones that are existential and practical. Of course, there will always be those opposed to change and yes evolution within society is not possible without change. But not all change is positive and positive movements can become destructive: look at how gay/lesbian liberation has been co-opted by trans rights activists.
If the EU can dictate our laws, lean on us to re-run referendums and we as citizens have no way to hold them accountable then yes, we’ve replaced British and Rome rule with Brussels rule. While I like the idea of being a citizen of the world and I certainly recognise the importance of being an internationalist, I also believe that each country should understand its own people and carry out the wishes of its people (within reason of course). Whether we like it or not, Brexit and Trump were two wake up calls to the establishment that the people were not happy with what was happening to their respective countries and the established parties have done their absolute best to misinterpret those concerns and stop these events (and the EU has been doing this as well), thus fuelling even more anger among the population.
Multiculturalism, as a political entity, boxes in ethnic groups and makes them compete against each other for the state approved grants. Not only does that create tensions (look at Birmingham 2005, Leicester 2022 and the recent UK General Election) but it also encourages individuals to see themselves as part of ethnic groups and thus the chances of integration and solidarity are lost, hence my remark re. the Rushdie Affair. Our core values should be that we are a liberal, secular nation who remember their past while pushing forward to the future and embraces absolute freedom of speech.
In terms of population freefall, it is one of the questions of our times. A recent report showed that well educated types tend to have less children than those with a basic education. While it’s tempting to think of the opening scene from the 2006 film Idiocracy, I think it stems from an anti-nuclear family sentiment that underpins a section of education and is passed onto students. However we cannot ignore the rising costs in living, in housing and the fact that general trust among the sexes is at an all time low (as any visit to Reddit and TikTok will testify to).
To be fair, Chungus, I never linked you in with Barret and his gang and neither would I. Expressing a comment, disagree as I do, does not make you a Nazi. Believe me, I do know an out and out neo-Nazi when I see or hear one. Your orations, if you don't mind me saying, do have an air of the xenophobe about them, accidentally no doubt.
ReplyDeleteThe far-right, Anthony, have been making statements about being 'a new minority' for decades. Back in the seventies the NF often spouted such crap, the voice of John Kingsley Read springs to mind. This was one of his rants to anybody stupid enough to listen. The religious right in the US should not be taken lightly, they are a danger. People like Pat Buchanan, if he's still around, preaching about "the righteous" and Gods country the USA for "the white man."
Caoimhin O'Muraile
Caoimhin - they have been doing it for over a hundred years. Somebody once commented on TPQ about only hearing foreign languages on O'Connell Street as a sign that the Irish were being swamped. There has never been anything but a foreign language on O'Connell Street - English for as far back as I remember. The fascist tries to create this imaginary past which it claims is being destroyed and which an anti-immigration stance will fix.
DeletePeople who have concerns about infrastructural problems posed by immigration rather than being driven by hatred are making a fair point and need to be listened to and not told to fuck off in the the way we might respond to a racist. The point Christopher makes.
I have concerns about intolerance in the country and I would worry if people arriving here tried to impose their own intolerance via religious or cultural mores. But this is not something unique to immigrants - there are still many people in this society who for mostly religious reasons are wholly intolerant of a woman's right to choose her options if pregnant.
I'd prefer more people of foreign nationality in the country than Irish priests. What use is a fuckin priest if we are ill? Those foreign doctors seem pretty useful! I'll be wanting one to give me the end of life assistance when my time is up. There will be no fucking priest mumbling gobbledegook when that moment comes!!