RTÉ Radio 1
Good Morning Ireland
23 June 2014
CM: Now Gerry Adams, the President of Sinn Féin, spoke at a party conference at the weekend and said among other things in relation to what might happen after the next general election:
For our part Sinn Féin needs to be ready for government in this state on our terms. Agree our policy priorities and political platform and our commitments need to be deliverable.
And he's on the line now on the telephone. Gerry Adams, Good Morning!
GA: Good Morning, Cathal.
CM: Now those words which I've just quoted could mean something or they could mean nothing different to what you'd expect to hear from any party leader ahead of an election. So can you give us an idea whether they mean something new?
GA: Yes, because I was speaking to the first Sinn Féin gathering, nationally, that's been held since the last elections. And Sinn Féin emerged as the largest political party on this island as a result of a mandate given to us by citizens across all thirty-two counties and we're very grateful for that. I was telling our folks we cannot let the people down, the people depend upon us.
And secondly given this, what I consider to be a seismic change, Sinn Féin needs to prepare for being in government. And that means getting our policy positions, our policy priorities ready. It means developing and working out where best we can stand in preparing our candidates.
But mostly and especially it means a change in the mindset of the party: that we want to be in government, we're ambitious for change, we're not going to go into government as Labour did just to provide a cover for conservative parties - so all of these issues need to be thrashed out by the party in the upcoming period.
So, to put it in a sentence – me talking then saying to Sinn Féin, particularly in The South because we are in government in The North, let's get ready to be in government. Let's work out the terms.
CM: Now, just to be clear whether the Sinn Féin position is any different to everybody else's, do you have any bottom lines? Clear bottom lines where you say to the electorate: unless we get this done or unless this changes specifically we're not going to do a coalition deal with anyone. Is there such a thing envisaged?
GA: Yes, because there's no point in being in government just for the sake of being in government. It might be fulfilling for some folks on a personal, ambitious level or those who pick up politics as a career might find some fulfillment in all of that and that's legitimate enough.
CM: Can you give us an idea of an area you'd envisage bottom lines in?
GA: Well you see the biggest point of difference, and one which I think we need to have a national conversation on, is about core Republican values. So we need to develop ourselves around what we believe to be core Republican values. And those core Republican values are about citizens – that citizens have entitlements - they're not privileges. They're not concessions. They are as a result of your birth that you have rights – so it's a right to a job, it's a right to a clean environment, it's a right to a house or to a home ...
CM: ...these are all generalities. What I'm asking is: Do you envisage any specifics on which Sinn Féin would have a bottom line to say: unless we get this or unless this changes we're not going into government with anyone. Do you envisage such a thing and can you give us any clue at this stage what you mean specifically?
GA: Well, the reason I was giving you – and these with respect, Cathal, aren't generalities - these are very fundamental points of principle. We need to have a programme for government part then which is clearly part of a process of bringing about those rights for citizens. We have a situation here where the top one percent of people own thirty-four percent of the wealth.
CM: Yeah. I didn't ask you about that. You know what I'm asking. I just want to try and get (crosstalk). Hold on, hold on. Let me get an idea...
GA: ... Well, I'm answering what you're asking. (crosstalk)
CM: Are you different from any other party? Because what every other party does is to say we'll do this, that or the other thing then do a deal after the election which might or might not contain what they envisaged in their plan. Now what I'm wondering is: Is Sinn Féin different in any specific way that you can tell us now?
GA: Yes. We are totally and absolutely different in that we will not promise anything we can't deliver on and we deliver on everything that we have promised and if we can't get a programme for government, if we have a mandate to negotiate for one, then we will not be in government. If you want to look at main differences...
CM: No, I don't. No, I don't. I just want to stick to specifics. Can I put you to one, please and this was in The Sunday Post yesterday - Pearse Doherty, your Finance spokesperson, said the property tax would be a deal breaker in an coalition deal (quote) “We've made it clear that if we're elected to the next government the property tax will be scrapped.” Is that a bottom line?
GA: Yes, but there are...and we've said that...I mean that's a matter of public record...
CM: Good. Now we have one and you're confirming it. Is there any other?
GA: Yes. We want to see, because we're a national party, we want to see a strategy for Irish unity. This government doesn't have such a thing. There's now a democratic way to bring that about. We want to engage with our Unionist neighbours in a process to achieve that constitutional objective so yes, we're not about being a twenty-six county party ...
CM: ...That's all very well. That's all very well. Can I ask you another specific which would affect people directly in their pockets: Sinn Féin has proposed a new higher rate of tax for high income earners. Would that be a bottom line?
GA: Well, we proposed a third rate of tax...
CM: ...Yeah, forty-eight percent.
GA: ...Yeah...for an income over one hundred thousand. You see when it comes down to it, Cathal, we shouldn't make any apologies for that ...
CM: Okay, sorry ... We've only limited time ... I'm not asking for any apologies about anything. I'm just asking to know whether that new rate of tax that you you've proposed – is that a bottom line or not?
GA: Cathal, I will talk and listen during this interview. Please give me the respect to let me answer the question in the way I want ...
CM: If you would please answer the question we'd all appreciate it.
GA: Sorry, in the way that I want to answer the question. We make no apologies for saying there should be a third rate of tax. Far better that that those who are very wealthy pick up the tab rather than take a medical card from a child with Down syndrome far better that a card allowance isn't cut.
And the point I was making earlier on about one percent owning thirty-four percent of the wealth is that between 2012 and 2013, when almost a half a million of our young people were scattered over the world, the two hundred and fifty richest people increased their wealth by three billion. So there's a bottom line.
CM: Mr. Adams. Mr. Adams ...
GA: ...that those people should pay - those who should and could pay more should pay more that we should protect the vulnerable. The other point: we need job stimulus. We need job stimulus. We need to put money into the economy.
CM: Do you mind if I just ask one more time to know whether it's specific or not. If you haven't made your mind up on it, fine – I just want to get it clear - you've proposed, your party has proposed a forty-eight percent tax rate for high earners, is that a bottom line or have you decided yet?
GA: Cathal, I was putting our people on alert that we need to be ready for government on our terms and agree our policy priorities. All these issues need to be dealt with in the upcoming period. I'm not going to start naming off a list, this is a bottom line, that's a bottom line, I'm trying to give you the general picture of what Sinn Féin in government would do.
CM: And I'm asking about specifics. Okay. Can I ask you just one other thing that has come up about which Sinn Féin has been criticised: Most recently on This Week on RTÉ yesterday by Seamus Mallon - this is about the sad death of Gerard Conlon and the position of those responsible for the fact that he was in prison for so long - and Seamus Mallon included the leadership of the IRA for being one of those groups responsible for leaving Gerry Conlon in prison for so long for a crime he didn't commit. Let's listen to just what he had to say:
Audio sound bite from Seamus Mallon is played:
Mallon: The IRA senior people who authorised the bombing in Guildford knew who did because they authorised them to do it. They also knew who didn't do it. And they knew that Gerry Conlon and the others involved didn't do it. And yet those people were almost conniving with a British establishment decision to keep an innocent man in gaol for sixteen years. I wonder what their consciences tell them now?
Audio sound bite ends.
CM: What's your response to that and the general accusation that the Republican Movement can make no criticism of what happened to Gerry Conlon because they were responsible in part for him being there.
GA: Well, first of all I would commend Paul Hill's remarks yesterday to anyone who has any interest in this issue. Seamus stretches the imagination to the breaking point to suggest that Republicans were conniving with the British establishment. The IRA unit, and this is from recollection – I was in prison at the time – but the IRA which was involved in the Guildford bombings came forward and acknowledged that they were involved in that.
And secondly, let me say that I was shocked to hear about the death of Gerry Conlon - I didn't know Gerry very well although I met him on the fringe of a number of conferences because as now is very well known he continued to campaign for victims of injustice and for those who had suffered from miscarriages of justice.
The responsibility for the detention and the incarceration a range of people there from the Guildford Four through the Birmingham Six to the Maguires and so on and so forth, rest absolutely with the British establishment.
The police there knew those individuals were not involved in those actions. And there was a cover-up and that's a matter of public record.
CM: The establishment's record is a disgrace – clearly. But can't the same be said about the IRA who knew - its members knew they did it. Its members did not come forward and make possible thereby the release of Gerry Conlon. I'm just wondering was that ever ...
GA: ...Cathal, Cathal, did you not hear what I said a moment ago? Check this out you don't have to take my word for it. The IRA unit which was responsible – I think that unit which was called ...
CM: ...the Balcome Street bombing, yes.
GA: Acknowledged! Acknowledged that they were involved in the bombing at Guildford. Now the IRA have to take responsibility for its own actions but let's not have Seamus Mallon trying to score political points. And I again commend the remarks of Paul Hill who dealt I think with all of this in a very, very forthright way and was interviewed in the same programme yesterday.
CM: But the fact is that a bomb went off at Guildford, people were killed, the IRA was responsible, the IRA members who were at large after that bombing did not come forward to say we did it when Gerry Conlon was arrested and gaoled.
GA: Well, I gave you my answer for that ...
CM: ...and therefore they are as responsible as those who arrested Gerry Conlon and put him behind bars. They are complicit as well.
GA: Well, with respect Cathal, and you know we could continue to butt back and forth on this issue – a very, very, very tragic issue - Guiseppe Conlon was told by the police that he could leave, this was Gerry's father, that he could leave Belfast and go to England to visit his son. When he got there he was arrested and ended up dying in prison. Tell me whose fault and whose responsibility that is.
The next point to make is this: all of this shows how troubling the past is. And there are efforts at the moment to try and sort out issues of the past: on flags and emblems and so on and so forth.
Sinn Féin signed up for the proposals that Richard Haass and Meghan O'Sullivan put forward. The British government did not do so. Martin McGuinness and I are meeting with the Taoiseach later this week and meeting with David Cameron a week or so after that. Both governments have a responsibility to deal with all of these issues.
And we cannot give Gerry Conlon back his fifteen years and we can not bring back those who were killed Guildford or Ballymurphy or Bloody Sunday or anywhere else but we can surely make sure this never happens again and we can, as our government should be doing, stand up to the British government in terms of both their obligations under the terms of the Good Friday Agreement.
GM: All right. And by the way I should have mentioned in the beginning that we came to you later than we planned and you're very good to hang on to talk to us. Gerry Adams, President of Sinn Féin ...
GA: ...I'm used to hanging on, Cathal.
CM: Thank you!
Thanks Anthony, that put the smile back on my face from when I heard it last week.
ReplyDeleteI wonder does Gerry's strategy for Irish unity extend to assisting Colin Duffy, Alex McCrory and Henry Fitzsimmons?
Menace,
ReplyDeleteit certainly will not. But it will amount going in to coalition with Fine Gael if FG are up for it. It is the same as the North - the strategy is 'never but will' and just feed the sheeple any old rubbish as they will swallow it anyway. Tommy McKearney said the SF bottom line is there is no bottom line. Office chasers, nothing more, nothing less.
You know you're preaching to the converted, though I never needed any converting.
ReplyDeletejaysus, what a load of shite. people can't still be taking this man seriously, can they? so adams wants to make sure these injustices never happen again? is he unaware of the craigavon 2? the constant scapegoating of colly duffy and internment of loads of other republicans?
ReplyDelete"I was in prison at the time" ffs was there ever a time he wasn't *conveniently* in prison when something that could incriminate him happened?
"I'm used to hanging on" ye sure are, big lad. hanging onto the coattails of fallen volunteers and dead hunger-strikers whose boots you could never even hope to lace.
it still brings about a wry smile to hear him use the term republican values, as if he has a clue what they even are.
when are the nationalist people of ireland going to wake up and stop voting SF?
I didn't agree with Mallon re the Guilford bombing and the subsequentl arrests !
ReplyDeleteTo agree with Mallon is to totally let the British establishment off the hook.
The Brits knew Gerry Conlon and the others were innocent . I agree with Adams, Seamus Mallon is trying to make political capital and like so many others he's a bit late. Maybe if Mallon had of been a bit more forthright about injustice, bombs would not have been exploding in England.
As for Adams and election promises! The Free State gave him a protest vote.
A man who stated that the party's position on Europe was, 'they were neither for or against it.'
On the scale of unscrupulous, he must be fever pitch but that doesn't seem to deter the voters.
Am I alone in thinking that Alex McCrory, Colin Duffy & Henry Fitzsimons are being stitched up?
ReplyDeleteThe maths don't add up in my head. I'm meant to believe that Alex McCrory who spent 14/15 yrs in the Hblocks, was one of the youngest on the blanket
He told the Sunday World how MI5 warned him that, without their help, he could face another lengthy jail sentence.
And he revealed how his 15-year-old son, who has no involvement with republicanism, was also arrested and held by cops at the same time in what he claims was a deliberate attempt to apply pressure to make him turn tout. McCrory, from West Belfast, served 14 years in the H-blocks for the Provisional IRA. He was one of the youngest ever blanketmen, joining the dirty protest when he was just 17. The veteran republican refused point-blank to have any dealings with the three spooks who approached him on Monday night, ordering them to "get the fuck out of my cell".
McCrory said: "No amount of money MI5 could pay, nothing they could say or do, could ever get me to work for them. They told me their offer was just between me and them and not to do anything silly like go to the press.
"I'm speaking out because spooks skulk in the shadows, totally unaccountable. It's time to flush them out. There's no shame in being approached by MI5 – the shame is in working for them."
and who constantly said that his phone, house etc are bugged is stupid enough to talk openly about getting a 'hit'...
Who knew he was being followed and tailed across Europe was approached on holiday by Mi5
Alex said his privately-rented holiday accommodation was approached by MI5 just three hours after his family arrived there.
Doesn't add up. My take is simple. Every now and again a Republican with pedigree makes noises and people start taking notice of and listening to is silenced by spooks in suits for not playing ball..So they play the man...
"He always has an alibi and one or two to spare
ReplyDeleteWhat ever time the deed took place Mac Adhaimh’s not there!"
Frankie, the weird thing about the case was when they claimed they had bugged a forest anticipating that CD would hold a meeting there. When do they ever reveal their trade craft so readily? It will be interesting to see if specific mics are referenced in the trial, or if its a generic reference.
frankie, no you're not alone. soon as i heard mccrory was lifted, my first thought was that it was yet another attempt by MI5 to get at the man.
ReplyDeleteothers think the same.