tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post2055793723689140214..comments2024-03-29T11:31:52.337+00:00Comments on TPQ: The Kesh '74AMhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00559413440743290550noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-77043166580587351422015-09-24T18:14:28.258+01:002015-09-24T18:14:28.258+01:00Cue,
A correction, my second question was on the ...Cue,<br /><br />A correction, my second question was on the Professor PFT article where he did not approve of my tone.<br />I believe you weighed in to defend the loyalist paramilitaries after I remarked they were vermin.<br /> <br />You make prison life sound like a picnic camp the monotony of routine is the enemy of both guard and prisoner. Why begrudge any who furthered education or do you Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-84303217826887574232015-09-24T04:19:06.656+01:002015-09-24T04:19:06.656+01:00Cue,
failing to understand you or are you failing...Cue,<br /><br />failing to understand you or are you failing to convey your comments in an understandable manner now you are circling the drain in the opposite direction.<br /><br />You will have to accommodate me, as English is my second language. You entered into the debate under one short line I mentioned to Beano, defending the salute remark. Then, you distance yourself from loyalists and Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-71597068327156966732015-09-23T20:33:07.869+01:002015-09-23T20:33:07.869+01:00Tain Bo,
You are completely failing to understan...Tain Bo, <br /><br />You are completely failing to understand me. I am not here to defend Beano or the Loyalist prisoners. They broke the law, as did republicans, and they were punished for it. They knew exactly what that entailed and I am absolutely certain that they did not expect to be congratulated by either the British army or the government for their actions. <br /><br />Just as a asideCue Bonohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15951825726248815243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-78392738963359464032015-09-23T20:23:15.816+01:002015-09-23T20:23:15.816+01:00Fionnuala,
It was not supposed to be like Butlins...Fionnuala,<br /><br />It was not supposed to be like Butlins, but it most definitely was not a concentration camp. The article above describes what happened when they burned down their own accommodation and armed themselves with cudgels for a fight. They then complain that they got hammered in the fight and didn't have anywhere to sleep. It was completely self inflicted and it is ludicrousCue Bonohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15951825726248815243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-36393651471812509362015-09-23T19:23:44.521+01:002015-09-23T19:23:44.521+01:00Cue,
I call it a concentration camp the fact tha...Cue, <br /><br />I call it a concentration camp the fact that it had a heavy military presence would suggest that it was not a standard prison or meet the definition of a standard prison.<br /><br />Can you say with any accuracy that I have not visited any of the Nazi death camps? I say death camps as that was their primary function you are polite to name a few. By design, death camps built to Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-83354335798851145002015-09-23T19:21:51.858+01:002015-09-23T19:21:51.858+01:00Cue,
as usual, you are circling the drain with ob...Cue,<br /><br />as usual, you are circling the drain with obtuse commentary little gravity needed to help it down the drain.<br /><br />You are not helping Beano and you are not helping the loyalists, offering the puniest absurdity as reason. I doubt even the dumbest Brit would have even considered the taig hunters as much else than common criminals. Factor in the boredom of being a guard, Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-7992585454290155122015-09-23T10:12:56.959+01:002015-09-23T10:12:56.959+01:00Cue Bono,
I think the distinction was being made b...Cue Bono,<br />I think the distinction was being made between what was supposed to be a POW camp and a Concentration Camp. If you read the Red Cross reports leading up to the time of the fire, it was a dire place. <br /><br />Speaking specifically about the internees. The Red Cross cited on numerous occasions that the place was grim, over crowded, poor sleeping conditions, bad food and a strong Fionnuala Perryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112456307341779243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-67176385754397177832015-09-22T23:18:10.440+01:002015-09-22T23:18:10.440+01:00Tain Bo,
I would suggest that if the British guar...Tain Bo,<br /><br />I would suggest that if the British guards had saluted Beano and co you would be fouling your pants about it. The loyalists decided that the best way they could defend their people was by breaking the law. The law punished them for it just as they punsihed republicans or the same.<br /><br />As for the ludicrous suggestion that Long Kesh was a concentration camp I suggest Cue Bonohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15951825726248815243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-83194541503410233162015-09-22T21:50:00.508+01:002015-09-22T21:50:00.508+01:00Beano,
you are in denial and being ridiculous poi...Beano,<br /><br />you are in denial and being ridiculous pointing out that the republicans burnt loyalist property.<br />What do you expect from republicans an apology?<br /><br />You still cannot point the finger at your overlords the Brits. Did an Irish court sentence you and the other drill time on square one loyalists? The answer is no, you decided on your own bat that you were going after Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-81233642392844579352015-09-22T19:31:19.120+01:002015-09-22T19:31:19.120+01:00If you are speaking about the previous account I ...If you are speaking about the previous account I wrote for the TPQ, that came from primary sources Beano people who were there. That's how research is carried out via people where possible, and through first and at times second hand accounts. In my piece, I relied on evidence statements from Fr Faul and Fr Murray and the men who were there, one such account was the one given above, which Fionnuala Perryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112456307341779243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-51086666681434758222015-09-22T10:00:22.488+01:002015-09-22T10:00:22.488+01:00Yes Táin, if we're fortunate enough we'll ...Yes Táin, if we're fortunate enough we'll mellow and mature with age. <br />Time, continuing education, on-going reflection, and in my own case geographical distance too, all support that process of maturation, all positively influencing the spin of fortune's wheel. <br /><br />As the wise old one says, "growing old is mandatory, whilst 'growing up' is optional." <brHenry JoYhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04161613445053833181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-46433795936116823612015-09-22T08:59:53.773+01:002015-09-22T08:59:53.773+01:00From Beano
In the absence of minuted accounts fr...<b> From Beano </b><br /><br />In the absence of minuted accounts from the Camp Council and as from your previous account of the fire which you have already admitted was second hand knowledge-as you weren’t there-this is, to me, another case of rewriting events to suit. I wouldn’t argue with the notion that the Loyalist cages may have been burned in the heat of the moment-I would also put it AMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00559413440743290550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-48837922041098496402015-09-22T08:01:19.933+01:002015-09-22T08:01:19.933+01:00Beano,
you agree the conditions in the camp becam...Beano,<br /><br />you agree the conditions in the camp became intolerable yet when push came to shove the loyalists holed up praying for the light of day to show up so the very people who made the conditions so intolerable could weigh in and save the loyalists.<br /><br />The regular Brits must have been pissing themselves laughing at the confused loyalist Paddies pretending they were the queens Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-38912230650825140682015-09-22T06:37:41.356+01:002015-09-22T06:37:41.356+01:00Henry,
I am glad you found some old memories rele...Henry,<br /><br />I am glad you found some old memories relevant to the account. It probably does enter into the sphere of the surreal being behind the wire and asking for a shirt that was funny or crude. Age is the only known cure for the defiant rebellious youth and that is iffy at best when it gets down to brass knuckles in the north.<br /><br />I understand the angst and the significance of Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-35907137776370221092015-09-21T22:30:37.511+01:002015-09-21T22:30:37.511+01:00Beano,
Loyalists did not act on the initial agree...Beano, <br />Loyalists did not act on the initial agreement, Republicans as was the case in all prison protests carried the can.<br />Warped logic actually deterred Loyalists from tackling a system that was in fact oppressing them.<br />I agree with you Loyalists huts should have been left intact primarily, due to the fact they wanted no part in any action, however, I should imagine it was in theFionnuala Perryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112456307341779243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-69605448531143865572015-09-21T22:23:26.681+01:002015-09-21T22:23:26.681+01:00Henry,
I am not ignoring your comment I will try ...Henry,<br /><br />I am not ignoring your comment I will try to reply soon, as I am typing or trying to type with one eye patched up and having to adjust my specs every few seconds so I can see the type. My apology on my delay.<br />Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-83047768985008676472015-09-21T22:22:33.975+01:002015-09-21T22:22:33.975+01:00Nuala,
thanks, I appreciate the sentiment though ...Nuala,<br /><br />thanks, I appreciate the sentiment though the real thanks go to Jim Mc Crystal and all who had the misfortune of going through the conveyer belt of Brit injustice. A big thanks to the Quill for taking the extra time formatting the handwritten copy into the article adding the personal touch often lost in type.<br /><br />If we call it, what it was a concentration camp: a camp Tain Bohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09441592658332493965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-29805837861593987632015-09-21T10:00:55.204+01:002015-09-21T10:00:55.204+01:00From Beano
Fionnuala—You’re right—there was an a...<b> From Beano </b><br /><br />Fionnuala—You’re right—there was an agreement by all prisoners groups that the situation had become intolerable. There was also an agreement that if Republicans were burning the camp that the Loyalist cages would be left intact. The admission by Jim that the IRA prisoners burned 9-11-12..all mixed UVF/UDA cages plus the cage that held YP’s-15...is the first AMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00559413440743290550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-8685336429405748642015-09-20T23:50:53.603+01:002015-09-20T23:50:53.603+01:00The place was a hell hole.
A big issue was compass...The place was a hell hole.<br />A big issue was compassionate parole,<br />searches, other issues were attacks by<br />dogs, degrading searchers, the quantity<br />and quality of food.<br /><br />The Red Cross had repeatedly highlighted<br />how dire the situation was.<br /><br />There was an agreement amongst all prisoners<br />groupings and leaders that the situation had<br />become intolerable.Fionnuala Perryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112456307341779243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-67938695602878932192015-09-20T12:14:51.138+01:002015-09-20T12:14:51.138+01:00Thanks Táin and thanks Jim.
I remember a couple o...Thanks Táin and thanks Jim.<br /><br />I remember a couple of visits I made to a friend in the Kesh in 74/75 previous and subsequent to the burning. A couple of surreal aspects of those visits have always stuck with me; my buddy had an obsession with 'T-shirts' particularly any with humorous or rude messages printed on and insisted that if I were to contribute to his parcel this was what Henry JoYhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04161613445053833181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4807238897188927967.post-57673021511006415582015-09-20T09:34:32.894+01:002015-09-20T09:34:32.894+01:00Brilliantly written Tsin Bo. I think the extent to...Brilliantly written Tsin Bo. I think the extent to which Republican prisoners refused to be submissive within the context of these harsh regimes has been greatly understated.<br /><br />Long Kesh was a hell hole, and it's follow up the H Blocks produced a different set of horrors.<br /><br />A fascinating recollection by Jim Mc Crystal, well presented by you Tain Bo. <br />Fionnuala Perryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16112456307341779243noreply@blogger.com